Audio |
Previous | 1 of 2 | Next |
Transcript of oral history interview conducted with
###### on November 1, 2011 for the
University on the Square: Documenting Egypt’s 21st Century Revolution project
Interviewer:
Okay. This is an oral interview for the American University in Cairo's University on the Square Project documenting Egypt's 21st Century Revolution. The interviewee is ###### and the interviewer is ######, the date is the 1st of November 2011 and we are in the house of the interviewee. Please give your name and connection with the AUC?
Interviewee:
I’m ###### and I don't actually have a connection with AUC.
Interviewer:
Okay. When and how did you first learn about the demonstrations of January 25th 2011?
Interviewee:
Well, I knew that they were planned because we had all been following the Kullena Khaled Said Facebook page, We Are All Khaled Said, and we knew that there were demonstrations planned for February 25th, it was a Tuesday.
Interviewer:
And have you been involved in demonstrations or political or social organizing before that time?
Interviewee:
No, never.
Interviewer:
Okay. Can you tell about any involvement that you had in the demonstrations of January and February, including any events you participated in or observed?
[00:01:02]
Interviewee:
Well, I wasn't actually in Cairo on the 25th of January. I was in France with a relative who had had an operation. And I came back to Egypt on the night of February the 28th and I arrived at the airport at seven o’clock in the evening and I couldn't leave the airport because there was so much fighting going on in the streets. That's the day that you know over eight hundred people were killed all over Egypt because there were demonstrations all over Egypt. I came home early the next morning, my husband came and took me from the airport. And, where I had spent the night, and I came home and changed my clothes and then immediately went to Tahrir. And I was extremely impressed and amazed by a hundred different things that I saw in Tahrir and basically wound up spending, all day, every day until midnight or after midnight in the Square until Mubarak stepped down on the 11th of February.
Interviewer:
How are the demonstrations structured or organized and by whom?
[00:02:01]
Interviewee:
Well, they weren't really organized, I mean they were very spontaneous because people came from, I mean, in Tahrir where I was, people came from all over Cairo, in fact people came from other cities, from other towns. I mean, you saw, you know, rich people, poor people, people from the countryside, people who said where they were - they were Nubians, people are from Aswan, people are from Ismailia, people are holding up sign, saying you know whatever government they were from, they weren't really, it wasn't a question of being organizing people to go there, people just spontaneously went. Once people were there, it was very organized because the entrances to the square were all manned, by volunteers, who would search you for weapons or for anything that could be harmful, just like the people do when you get on an airplane for example. And then once also in this where people are distributing food, lots of people bring food and sandwiches with them. People were distributing blankets, water, there was a little nursery, there was a medical clinic, there was a place where you could take your photographs, digital photographs on a USB or on a DVD or something in media tent. Once you were in the Square, it was highly, highly organized by volunteers but these things also developed over time, and it wasn't like the first day of the demonstrations there was a media tent and the clinic and the nursery. No, I mean these things all developed over time.
[00:03:27]
Interviewer:
Okay. Did you have contacts with any of the prominent individuals involved in the events of January and February?
Interviewee:
Not then, not at the time. I did afterwards, I interviewed about nine of the people in the Youth Coalition Internationalists lel Thawra including many of the April 6th members who had organized the first demonstrations on the 25th. But that all came later, at the time I didn't know anybody.
Interviewer:
Can you give a description of the demonstrators you encountered, any social background, profession?
Interviewee:
Like I said, they were all kinds. I mean you would see, I mean you were there yourself, and you would remember -
Interviewer:
I wasn’t there, I was abroad.
Interviewee:
You weren't there? When did you come back?
Interviewer:
On the 28th of February. I was demonstrating in Paris.
[00:04:14]
Interviewee:
You would see all kinds of people, I mean, you would see very, very, very poor people and you would see people who are clearly you know, very upper class and you would see everything in between. And you would see, you know people who are very - wearing very westernized clothing and you would see people who are completely wearing traditional clothing or wearing niqab or - of course lot of women wearing hijab. See, really it was a complete cross-section of Egyptian society. And I try to show this in my book, ######, which has 150 photographs of people holding signs in Tahrir and I very carefully tried to pick photographs that showed the different ranges of people who were there.
Interviewer:
Were there particular groups congregated by the particular locations?
Interviewee:
Yes, there were, with time then people started putting up stages or congregating in different parts of the Square and so you would have, the April 6th or the Youth Coalition Group stage over there and the Muslim Brotherhood tended to be over here, and like that. But in a sort of general manner.
[00:05:17]
Interviewer:
And how did people have different backgrounds interact?
Interviewee:
People, I think, I mean I know that people were just interacting very freely and openly. And for many, many, many, many Egyptians, they were really seeing each other for the first time. So, I mean you know, middle class people were interacting very openly with you know, people from other social backgrounds to which they never would have before and getting along you know, extremely well and at the same time Muslims and Christians, some Muslims were interacting with Christians for the very first time and vice versa. And this was very, very evident in the Square and created a sort of fantastic atmosphere.
Interviewer:
Can you describe the presence of AUC faculty students and staff at the demonstrations in their roles? And are there any particular individual individuals you would like to mention?
[00:06:05]
Interviewee:
Well, I don't know about faculty and staff at such, I mean I certainly ran into a lot of people I knew who were staff, I mean people like, you know, I mean, they were there all the time. People from Cairo University as well, like ######, ######, you know they were there all the time. People from Cairo University like ###### or ###### all kinds of people, like ######, ######. All kinds of people. There are many, many you see AUC graduates there, I mean for example someone very prominent is like ######, the blogger and he's an AUC graduate but there are many others. And I remember one of the Youth Coalition people telling me in March and April, that on the very first day of demonstrations on the 25th of January, he was one of the organizers of the demos and he was doing the circle, he is sort of doing the circumference of the Square several times to sort of gauge, how many people were there on that very first day and he said, that 75 percent of the people there on that first day were, what he called upper middle class Egyptians and many of those looked like they were sort of, kind of AUCians.
[00:07:10]
Interviewer:
Were there features, chants, performances, things you overheard people say, like jokes, leaflets, or banners or signs that are especially memorable?
Interviewee:
There were so many chants, so many songs and so many, I mean there were thousands of signs and again that's why I did my book, you know, ###### of the signs. But in terms of chants and songs, I mean, they are too many to remember, they were all amazing, they are very creative very, very inspiring.
Interviewer:
Do you have any other impressions about the physical location or settings of the focus or Tahrir or elsewhere?
[00:07:44]
Interviewee:
Well, I only went to the protests in Tahrir. And in terms of physical impressions, I mean it was very claustrophobic some days because there are so many people in the Square, I mean you literally, if you were on one side of the Square, and you walked cross to the other side, it could take you one and a half or two hours just to get across because there are so many people and you couldn't scratch your nose, I mean, there were so many people. But people were very gentle and very kind and very helpful. And I was never physically bothered or harassed nor any of the women I have talked to during those first eighteen days, on the contrary, men were very helpful to sort of help you get from one side of the Square to another. It was a very inspiring time, and very inspiring place. And many of us have often said since that it was as if everything good in the Egyptian character was present in those eighteen days in the Square.
Interviewer:
Can you describe the commercial or service activities that emerged at the demonstration, like food vendors, cleaning medical services, and the situation for existing shops?
[00:08:55]
Interviewee:
Well, if we are talking only about the first eighteen days or we are talking about afterwards?
Interviewer:
Yeah, no, only the eighteen days [unintelligible].
Interviewee:
First 18 days, there wasn't really much commercial activity. I mean, all the food, that was brought etc, it was just donations and volunteers brought. Okay. The shops that were nearby, nothing, there wasn't really any commercial activity during those eighteen days. Everything - all the food and drink and stuff was donated or people would collect money and go and send someone to buy it and that person would come back. The shops that were around the Square, I mean, nothing was vandalized, nothing was destroyed. I mean, things were shut, I mean, Kentucky Fried Chicken was shut for example, but it wasn't vandalized.
Interviewer:
Can you tell us about any aspects of demonstrators camping or sleeping in the Tahrir Square?
Interviewee:
I didn't sleep there I have a young daughter, so I would go home every night. I just know that there were tense and people of all kinds were you know putting up tents next to each other and it was a very congenial atmosphere. And it was very safe. That's all I know.
[00:10:07]
Interviewer:
Did you personally witness any violence or did you suffer any injuries, or bodily or see it happened to others?
Interviewee:
No, I did not.
Interviewer:
Did you expect this violence at the time or where you caught up guard in general, did you expect the level of violence that occurred?
Interviewee:
I was walking into the Square the day of the Battle of the Camel and I was warned to leave the Square, so I walked out, that was something that was completely unexpected. And I went and spent the night at a friend's house in Abdeen, and we didn't sleep because there were gunshots all night long.
Interviewer:
Besides violent acts, were you harassed or interrogated or did you notice that happening to anyone?
Interviewee:
I wasn’t harassed but I was interrogated several times trying to go into the Square with an army soldiers had try to prevent me from going into the Square. Say that I wasn't allowed to go in, if I had a camera. So, I point out that you know, there are hundred thousand people standing in the Square, all with cameras on their mobiles. So it's kind of ridiculous.
[00:11:05]
Interviewer:
If you saw any property damage, how and when did it happened, and who was involved?
Interviewee:
I didn't see any property damage at all.
Interviewer:
What do you think were the most pivotal moments of the events in January and February?
Interviewee:
Well, gosh, there are so many, it's hard to remember. I mean clearly the 25th was a huge day. 28th was a huge day. The Battle of the Camel on the second was a huge day. The day Wael Ghoneim was released, was huge. Next day was, the demonstrations were massive, the day of the second speech, Mubarak's second speech was a big disappointment. The day - the Thursday, the 10th of February was very disappointing and we all waited till ten-thirty at night thinking he was going to leave and he didn't leave. The moment of his stepping down on February 11th, at six o’clock in the evening or five-thirty in the evening was amazing, I was in the Square, I will never forget it as long as I live, it was amazing. After that, after those first eighteen days, then of course there were, you know, when the military attacked Square, I think on March 9th, when the protesters were dragged to the back of the Egyptian Museum and tortured and there were at the virginity tests, when people were beaten up outside the parliament. Again, I think in March 9th, there's also April 9th, the same thing happened. The day the army officers announced they were joining the revolution and they were shot and shot dead in the Square, at point blank range. There are many, really quite remarkable and astonishing and shattering events at the same time.
[00:12:42]
Interviewer:
Can you comment on how your perceptions and emotions changed over the 18 days of the revolution and the weeks afterwards?
Interviewee:
Well the first 18 days, we were very hopeful. And there was a sort of great sense of unanimity, and cooperation and collaboration. After that things became less clear particularly now, and people have become very apathetic and sort of - people aren't directly involved in the revolution are kind of disappointed thinking that the revolution is not giving them what they asked for but I don't know, as far as I am concerned revolution hasn’t even started yet.
Interviewer:
Did you personally observe the diversity of opinion about the events of the revolution? If so, did this apply to members of your family, social circle, neighborhood?
[00:13:36]
Interviewee:
All the time. I mean, all the time people were either devastated because they didn't want the revolution in the first place or devastated because they think the revolution of going far enough or saying, well, now it's over, Mubarak has left, what you want and a lot of people of course benefitted from the old regime and a lot of people, even if they didn't like the old regime, they want stability and they don't want - you know, they want tourism to come back and all these things. So, on the contrary now, going out socially is kind of a minefield, where you basically have arguments with everybody, who is there and a lot of people are trying to avoid talking politics. That just means it's like a real country, where different people have different opinions, we don't all think the same thing.
Interviewer:
What media outlets did you follow?
Interviewee:
I mainly watched Al Jazeera international but Al Jazeera English. But more than anything else, I follow Facebook and Twitter. I mean during the revolution, I was probably in the Square about fourteen, fifteen hours a day and then on Facebook for the rest of the time.
Interviewer:
Okay. And can you compare the coverage of events you saw on different television channels or print sources?
Interviewee:
Yeah, a lot of the print sources were hopeless. A lot of the television channels are hopeless, the most accurate really was Facebook and Twitter. And Jazeera English was excellent.
[00:14:57]
Interviewer:
How closely did the media coverage matched what you personally experienced?
Interviewee:
Well, depending which media, I mean, Facebook and Twitter matched what I was seeing and experiencing, Jazeera International, Jazeera English was very, very good. CNN was okay, it's good, it's alright. BBC English and Arabic were okay. A lot of other things are very biased and Egyptian press was usually either woefully behind or just inaccurate.
Interviewer:
Have you noticed changes in them, Egyptian media since Mubarak stepped down?
Interviewee:
Yes, the private satellite channels have become more daring. The print media some has become more daring, some has become completely apologetic for the old regime, and almost seems to be completely feloul or old regime. But some of the satellite channels are doing very good things like particularly ON TV, which now I think everybody is glued to all the time.
Interviewer:
Did you use internet or social media sites like Facebook or Twitter, and in that way?
[00:16:00]
Interviewee:
Yeah. Constantly to find, I mean during the revolution, I was constantly on Facebook to find out which streets were safe to go on or Twitter. And now I still do it to share information, to share articles, to share, YouTube clips, etc. In particular during Maspero, it was very useful way of getting, the news out, sharing them.
Interviewer:
Can you describe what the internet and mobile phone outage was like?
Interviewee:
I wasn’t here.
Interviewer:
What were some of the rumors you heard, what do you think their sources were and which had the most impact?
Interviewee:
Well, there are lot of rumors about violence happening all over town. And I don't never know what to believe and what not to believe. It's hard to know who's spreading them, if they are rumors, if it's sort of deliberate, they are deliberately being spread or by, you know, people want to make us feel insecure or actually people just believe them and spread them.
[00:16:57]
Interviewer:
During the first eighteen days of the revolution and immediately afterwards, what were conditions like in the neighborhood, where you lived or areas you visited?
Interviewee:
It was extremely safe here because there are a lot of people's committees. And so in fact it was extremely difficult to get onto Zamalek and you had to show your ID, and your current driver's license and all that stuff. So, actually we felt extremely safe, felt safe with them that I do know.
Interviewer:
And how did the curfew affect you?
Interviewee:
It didn't, we would walk home every night at 1:00 AM, it didn't affect us at all.
Interviewer:
Did you leave Cairo or Egypt at some point?
Interviewee:
No.
Interviewer:
Did you know many people who did?
Interviewee:
A lot of people left, yes. I only left my house to go to Tahrir.
Interviewer:
Did you know people who returned to Egypt specifically for the demonstrations or know someone who has actively demonstrating in another country?
Interviewee:
Yes. Yes. I know people who came back who are, specifically for the demonstrations.
Interviewer:
Do you know people who are active in other countries?
Interviewee:
No, not really.
[00:18:00]
Interviewer:
Have you been involved in demonstrations and in other events since the departure of Mubarak?
Interviewee:
Yes.
Interviewer:
Can you describe them?
Interviewee:
Well, I particularly involved in the no military trials, demonstration on the 9th of September. I mean involved in the sense that I went and I stayed all day and you know, put on stickers that they had circulated, I mean, like that yellow sticker on the table there.
Interviewer:
What do you think were the most pivotal moment since Mubarak stepped down?
Interviewee:
Well, I mean there was the leaving of Shafik, there was different things that the army has done in the Square in terms of torture and you know, attacking protesters. I think two things that have been extremely now, I mean, the massacre at Maspero, couple of weeks ago and the arresting of Alaa Abd El Fattah, the blogger.
[00:18:58]
Interviewer:
How did the revolution affect, since AUC, have you noticed changes in the opinions or engagement in politics and social -
Interviewee:
I don't really know because I am not associated with AUC.
Interviewer:
What do you think the near term and enduring changes of Egyptian political and social life will be?
Interviewee:
Well, it's hard to know really - I mean on one level things have changed forever and people are much more politically engaged and they are more political parties and the parties are now moving towards you know, participating in elections, etc. So, one level things have changed a great deal, another level, I don't know that things have changed at all because, it's not really, I mean there are a lot of the old National Democratic Party people are running in these new elections. The SCAF seems to be intent on business as usual. It's not really clear how much change will have been achieved.
[00:19:58]
Interviewer:
Can you compare that to the expectations for Egypt's future before the revolution?
Interviewee:
Before the revolution or during the revolution?
Interviewer:
Before the revolution?
Interviewee:
Before the revolution, I had no expectations. I thought there's going to be revolution at some point but nobody knew when and how. During the revolution we were very euphoric and had very high expectations and now, I think everybody is quite disappointed the way things have turned up and other countries like Tunisia seem to be doing progressing much, in a much better way than we have.
Interviewer:
And has the revolution fundamentally changed some of your views?
Interviewee:
No.
Interviewer:
Is there anything you would like to add?
Interviewee:
No, I think that was quite comprehensive.
Interview:
Thank you.
Interviewee:
You’re welcome.
[00:20:39]
[End of Interview]
Object Description
Description
| Title | Audio |
| Type | Sound recordings |
| Format | audio/mp3 |
| Extent | 00:20:39 |
| Collection | University on the Square: Documenting Egypt's 21st Century Revolution |
| Transcript | Transcript of oral history interview conducted with ###### on November 1, 2011 for the University on the Square: Documenting Egypt’s 21st Century Revolution project Interviewer: Okay. This is an oral interview for the American University in Cairo's University on the Square Project documenting Egypt's 21st Century Revolution. The interviewee is ###### and the interviewer is ######, the date is the 1st of November 2011 and we are in the house of the interviewee. Please give your name and connection with the AUC? Interviewee: I’m ###### and I don't actually have a connection with AUC. Interviewer: Okay. When and how did you first learn about the demonstrations of January 25th 2011? Interviewee: Well, I knew that they were planned because we had all been following the Kullena Khaled Said Facebook page, We Are All Khaled Said, and we knew that there were demonstrations planned for February 25th, it was a Tuesday. Interviewer: And have you been involved in demonstrations or political or social organizing before that time? Interviewee: No, never. Interviewer: Okay. Can you tell about any involvement that you had in the demonstrations of January and February, including any events you participated in or observed? [00:01:02] Interviewee: Well, I wasn't actually in Cairo on the 25th of January. I was in France with a relative who had had an operation. And I came back to Egypt on the night of February the 28th and I arrived at the airport at seven o’clock in the evening and I couldn't leave the airport because there was so much fighting going on in the streets. That's the day that you know over eight hundred people were killed all over Egypt because there were demonstrations all over Egypt. I came home early the next morning, my husband came and took me from the airport. And, where I had spent the night, and I came home and changed my clothes and then immediately went to Tahrir. And I was extremely impressed and amazed by a hundred different things that I saw in Tahrir and basically wound up spending, all day, every day until midnight or after midnight in the Square until Mubarak stepped down on the 11th of February. Interviewer: How are the demonstrations structured or organized and by whom? [00:02:01] Interviewee: Well, they weren't really organized, I mean they were very spontaneous because people came from, I mean, in Tahrir where I was, people came from all over Cairo, in fact people came from other cities, from other towns. I mean, you saw, you know, rich people, poor people, people from the countryside, people who said where they were - they were Nubians, people are from Aswan, people are from Ismailia, people are holding up sign, saying you know whatever government they were from, they weren't really, it wasn't a question of being organizing people to go there, people just spontaneously went. Once people were there, it was very organized because the entrances to the square were all manned, by volunteers, who would search you for weapons or for anything that could be harmful, just like the people do when you get on an airplane for example. And then once also in this where people are distributing food, lots of people bring food and sandwiches with them. People were distributing blankets, water, there was a little nursery, there was a medical clinic, there was a place where you could take your photographs, digital photographs on a USB or on a DVD or something in media tent. Once you were in the Square, it was highly, highly organized by volunteers but these things also developed over time, and it wasn't like the first day of the demonstrations there was a media tent and the clinic and the nursery. No, I mean these things all developed over time. [00:03:27] Interviewer: Okay. Did you have contacts with any of the prominent individuals involved in the events of January and February? Interviewee: Not then, not at the time. I did afterwards, I interviewed about nine of the people in the Youth Coalition Internationalists lel Thawra including many of the April 6th members who had organized the first demonstrations on the 25th. But that all came later, at the time I didn't know anybody. Interviewer: Can you give a description of the demonstrators you encountered, any social background, profession? Interviewee: Like I said, they were all kinds. I mean you would see, I mean you were there yourself, and you would remember - Interviewer: I wasn’t there, I was abroad. Interviewee: You weren't there? When did you come back? Interviewer: On the 28th of February. I was demonstrating in Paris. [00:04:14] Interviewee: You would see all kinds of people, I mean, you would see very, very, very poor people and you would see people who are clearly you know, very upper class and you would see everything in between. And you would see, you know people who are very - wearing very westernized clothing and you would see people who are completely wearing traditional clothing or wearing niqab or - of course lot of women wearing hijab. See, really it was a complete cross-section of Egyptian society. And I try to show this in my book, ######, which has 150 photographs of people holding signs in Tahrir and I very carefully tried to pick photographs that showed the different ranges of people who were there. Interviewer: Were there particular groups congregated by the particular locations? Interviewee: Yes, there were, with time then people started putting up stages or congregating in different parts of the Square and so you would have, the April 6th or the Youth Coalition Group stage over there and the Muslim Brotherhood tended to be over here, and like that. But in a sort of general manner. [00:05:17] Interviewer: And how did people have different backgrounds interact? Interviewee: People, I think, I mean I know that people were just interacting very freely and openly. And for many, many, many, many Egyptians, they were really seeing each other for the first time. So, I mean you know, middle class people were interacting very openly with you know, people from other social backgrounds to which they never would have before and getting along you know, extremely well and at the same time Muslims and Christians, some Muslims were interacting with Christians for the very first time and vice versa. And this was very, very evident in the Square and created a sort of fantastic atmosphere. Interviewer: Can you describe the presence of AUC faculty students and staff at the demonstrations in their roles? And are there any particular individual individuals you would like to mention? [00:06:05] Interviewee: Well, I don't know about faculty and staff at such, I mean I certainly ran into a lot of people I knew who were staff, I mean people like, you know, I mean, they were there all the time. People from Cairo University as well, like ######, ######, you know they were there all the time. People from Cairo University like ###### or ###### all kinds of people, like ######, ######. All kinds of people. There are many, many you see AUC graduates there, I mean for example someone very prominent is like ######, the blogger and he's an AUC graduate but there are many others. And I remember one of the Youth Coalition people telling me in March and April, that on the very first day of demonstrations on the 25th of January, he was one of the organizers of the demos and he was doing the circle, he is sort of doing the circumference of the Square several times to sort of gauge, how many people were there on that very first day and he said, that 75 percent of the people there on that first day were, what he called upper middle class Egyptians and many of those looked like they were sort of, kind of AUCians. [00:07:10] Interviewer: Were there features, chants, performances, things you overheard people say, like jokes, leaflets, or banners or signs that are especially memorable? Interviewee: There were so many chants, so many songs and so many, I mean there were thousands of signs and again that's why I did my book, you know, ###### of the signs. But in terms of chants and songs, I mean, they are too many to remember, they were all amazing, they are very creative very, very inspiring. Interviewer: Do you have any other impressions about the physical location or settings of the focus or Tahrir or elsewhere? [00:07:44] Interviewee: Well, I only went to the protests in Tahrir. And in terms of physical impressions, I mean it was very claustrophobic some days because there are so many people in the Square, I mean you literally, if you were on one side of the Square, and you walked cross to the other side, it could take you one and a half or two hours just to get across because there are so many people and you couldn't scratch your nose, I mean, there were so many people. But people were very gentle and very kind and very helpful. And I was never physically bothered or harassed nor any of the women I have talked to during those first eighteen days, on the contrary, men were very helpful to sort of help you get from one side of the Square to another. It was a very inspiring time, and very inspiring place. And many of us have often said since that it was as if everything good in the Egyptian character was present in those eighteen days in the Square. Interviewer: Can you describe the commercial or service activities that emerged at the demonstration, like food vendors, cleaning medical services, and the situation for existing shops? [00:08:55] Interviewee: Well, if we are talking only about the first eighteen days or we are talking about afterwards? Interviewer: Yeah, no, only the eighteen days [unintelligible]. Interviewee: First 18 days, there wasn't really much commercial activity. I mean, all the food, that was brought etc, it was just donations and volunteers brought. Okay. The shops that were nearby, nothing, there wasn't really any commercial activity during those eighteen days. Everything - all the food and drink and stuff was donated or people would collect money and go and send someone to buy it and that person would come back. The shops that were around the Square, I mean, nothing was vandalized, nothing was destroyed. I mean, things were shut, I mean, Kentucky Fried Chicken was shut for example, but it wasn't vandalized. Interviewer: Can you tell us about any aspects of demonstrators camping or sleeping in the Tahrir Square? Interviewee: I didn't sleep there I have a young daughter, so I would go home every night. I just know that there were tense and people of all kinds were you know putting up tents next to each other and it was a very congenial atmosphere. And it was very safe. That's all I know. [00:10:07] Interviewer: Did you personally witness any violence or did you suffer any injuries, or bodily or see it happened to others? Interviewee: No, I did not. Interviewer: Did you expect this violence at the time or where you caught up guard in general, did you expect the level of violence that occurred? Interviewee: I was walking into the Square the day of the Battle of the Camel and I was warned to leave the Square, so I walked out, that was something that was completely unexpected. And I went and spent the night at a friend's house in Abdeen, and we didn't sleep because there were gunshots all night long. Interviewer: Besides violent acts, were you harassed or interrogated or did you notice that happening to anyone? Interviewee: I wasn’t harassed but I was interrogated several times trying to go into the Square with an army soldiers had try to prevent me from going into the Square. Say that I wasn't allowed to go in, if I had a camera. So, I point out that you know, there are hundred thousand people standing in the Square, all with cameras on their mobiles. So it's kind of ridiculous. [00:11:05] Interviewer: If you saw any property damage, how and when did it happened, and who was involved? Interviewee: I didn't see any property damage at all. Interviewer: What do you think were the most pivotal moments of the events in January and February? Interviewee: Well, gosh, there are so many, it's hard to remember. I mean clearly the 25th was a huge day. 28th was a huge day. The Battle of the Camel on the second was a huge day. The day Wael Ghoneim was released, was huge. Next day was, the demonstrations were massive, the day of the second speech, Mubarak's second speech was a big disappointment. The day - the Thursday, the 10th of February was very disappointing and we all waited till ten-thirty at night thinking he was going to leave and he didn't leave. The moment of his stepping down on February 11th, at six o’clock in the evening or five-thirty in the evening was amazing, I was in the Square, I will never forget it as long as I live, it was amazing. After that, after those first eighteen days, then of course there were, you know, when the military attacked Square, I think on March 9th, when the protesters were dragged to the back of the Egyptian Museum and tortured and there were at the virginity tests, when people were beaten up outside the parliament. Again, I think in March 9th, there's also April 9th, the same thing happened. The day the army officers announced they were joining the revolution and they were shot and shot dead in the Square, at point blank range. There are many, really quite remarkable and astonishing and shattering events at the same time. [00:12:42] Interviewer: Can you comment on how your perceptions and emotions changed over the 18 days of the revolution and the weeks afterwards? Interviewee: Well the first 18 days, we were very hopeful. And there was a sort of great sense of unanimity, and cooperation and collaboration. After that things became less clear particularly now, and people have become very apathetic and sort of - people aren't directly involved in the revolution are kind of disappointed thinking that the revolution is not giving them what they asked for but I don't know, as far as I am concerned revolution hasn’t even started yet. Interviewer: Did you personally observe the diversity of opinion about the events of the revolution? If so, did this apply to members of your family, social circle, neighborhood? [00:13:36] Interviewee: All the time. I mean, all the time people were either devastated because they didn't want the revolution in the first place or devastated because they think the revolution of going far enough or saying, well, now it's over, Mubarak has left, what you want and a lot of people of course benefitted from the old regime and a lot of people, even if they didn't like the old regime, they want stability and they don't want - you know, they want tourism to come back and all these things. So, on the contrary now, going out socially is kind of a minefield, where you basically have arguments with everybody, who is there and a lot of people are trying to avoid talking politics. That just means it's like a real country, where different people have different opinions, we don't all think the same thing. Interviewer: What media outlets did you follow? Interviewee: I mainly watched Al Jazeera international but Al Jazeera English. But more than anything else, I follow Facebook and Twitter. I mean during the revolution, I was probably in the Square about fourteen, fifteen hours a day and then on Facebook for the rest of the time. Interviewer: Okay. And can you compare the coverage of events you saw on different television channels or print sources? Interviewee: Yeah, a lot of the print sources were hopeless. A lot of the television channels are hopeless, the most accurate really was Facebook and Twitter. And Jazeera English was excellent. [00:14:57] Interviewer: How closely did the media coverage matched what you personally experienced? Interviewee: Well, depending which media, I mean, Facebook and Twitter matched what I was seeing and experiencing, Jazeera International, Jazeera English was very, very good. CNN was okay, it's good, it's alright. BBC English and Arabic were okay. A lot of other things are very biased and Egyptian press was usually either woefully behind or just inaccurate. Interviewer: Have you noticed changes in them, Egyptian media since Mubarak stepped down? Interviewee: Yes, the private satellite channels have become more daring. The print media some has become more daring, some has become completely apologetic for the old regime, and almost seems to be completely feloul or old regime. But some of the satellite channels are doing very good things like particularly ON TV, which now I think everybody is glued to all the time. Interviewer: Did you use internet or social media sites like Facebook or Twitter, and in that way? [00:16:00] Interviewee: Yeah. Constantly to find, I mean during the revolution, I was constantly on Facebook to find out which streets were safe to go on or Twitter. And now I still do it to share information, to share articles, to share, YouTube clips, etc. In particular during Maspero, it was very useful way of getting, the news out, sharing them. Interviewer: Can you describe what the internet and mobile phone outage was like? Interviewee: I wasn’t here. Interviewer: What were some of the rumors you heard, what do you think their sources were and which had the most impact? Interviewee: Well, there are lot of rumors about violence happening all over town. And I don't never know what to believe and what not to believe. It's hard to know who's spreading them, if they are rumors, if it's sort of deliberate, they are deliberately being spread or by, you know, people want to make us feel insecure or actually people just believe them and spread them. [00:16:57] Interviewer: During the first eighteen days of the revolution and immediately afterwards, what were conditions like in the neighborhood, where you lived or areas you visited? Interviewee: It was extremely safe here because there are a lot of people's committees. And so in fact it was extremely difficult to get onto Zamalek and you had to show your ID, and your current driver's license and all that stuff. So, actually we felt extremely safe, felt safe with them that I do know. Interviewer: And how did the curfew affect you? Interviewee: It didn't, we would walk home every night at 1:00 AM, it didn't affect us at all. Interviewer: Did you leave Cairo or Egypt at some point? Interviewee: No. Interviewer: Did you know many people who did? Interviewee: A lot of people left, yes. I only left my house to go to Tahrir. Interviewer: Did you know people who returned to Egypt specifically for the demonstrations or know someone who has actively demonstrating in another country? Interviewee: Yes. Yes. I know people who came back who are, specifically for the demonstrations. Interviewer: Do you know people who are active in other countries? Interviewee: No, not really. [00:18:00] Interviewer: Have you been involved in demonstrations and in other events since the departure of Mubarak? Interviewee: Yes. Interviewer: Can you describe them? Interviewee: Well, I particularly involved in the no military trials, demonstration on the 9th of September. I mean involved in the sense that I went and I stayed all day and you know, put on stickers that they had circulated, I mean, like that yellow sticker on the table there. Interviewer: What do you think were the most pivotal moment since Mubarak stepped down? Interviewee: Well, I mean there was the leaving of Shafik, there was different things that the army has done in the Square in terms of torture and you know, attacking protesters. I think two things that have been extremely now, I mean, the massacre at Maspero, couple of weeks ago and the arresting of Alaa Abd El Fattah, the blogger. [00:18:58] Interviewer: How did the revolution affect, since AUC, have you noticed changes in the opinions or engagement in politics and social - Interviewee: I don't really know because I am not associated with AUC. Interviewer: What do you think the near term and enduring changes of Egyptian political and social life will be? Interviewee: Well, it's hard to know really - I mean on one level things have changed forever and people are much more politically engaged and they are more political parties and the parties are now moving towards you know, participating in elections, etc. So, one level things have changed a great deal, another level, I don't know that things have changed at all because, it's not really, I mean there are a lot of the old National Democratic Party people are running in these new elections. The SCAF seems to be intent on business as usual. It's not really clear how much change will have been achieved. [00:19:58] Interviewer: Can you compare that to the expectations for Egypt's future before the revolution? Interviewee: Before the revolution or during the revolution? Interviewer: Before the revolution? Interviewee: Before the revolution, I had no expectations. I thought there's going to be revolution at some point but nobody knew when and how. During the revolution we were very euphoric and had very high expectations and now, I think everybody is quite disappointed the way things have turned up and other countries like Tunisia seem to be doing progressing much, in a much better way than we have. Interviewer: And has the revolution fundamentally changed some of your views? Interviewee: No. Interviewer: Is there anything you would like to add? Interviewee: No, I think that was quite comprehensive. Interview: Thank you. Interviewee: You’re welcome. [00:20:39] [End of Interview] |
Tags
Comments
Post a Comment for Audio
